After sixty comments (some of which were posted under a pseudonym) I felt compelled to add:
In which I attempt to clarify and own my mistakes:
1) The original draft of the story used both “gypsy” and “tinker” because I was wholly unaware of the racial/derogatory connotations of those words. I’ve read a lot of very old folktales that referenced the threat that the child would be sold to the gypsies, and that was the springboard for this piece.
That very much demonstrates both my ignorance and my white privilege.
2) The very first market I sent this story to was Clarkesworld. Nick Mamatas’s scathing rejection of the piece made it very clear that he thought it was racist. He said (and I’m paraphrasing, because I’ve since deleted the rejection) that he’d no more buy a story that featured a child being sold to the tinkers, the gypsies, the gitano or any other racial slur than he would a story in which Jews bought children to grind them into matza. (Please see the commentary made by “Djano Schmeinhardt” on the storythread. It reads like the same argument, and if it’s Nick, I wish he would have posted under his real name.)
3) I was absolutely horrified to realize the first draft of the story read as racist or bigoted. I immediately went to do research into both the nomadic peoples of Europe and folkloric devices. The piece was never intended to further negative racial stereotypes; it was supposed to be about a heroine that refuses to conform. Both gentlemen at the heart of this discussion have asserted that the child being sold is the crux of the story, but I disagree.
4) Because I disagreed with Mr. Mamatas (but did not want to offend anyone of Romani or Irish descent) I examined the roles in the story and renamed everyone so that there was no racial implication. I needed a man and woman traveling and that was it; this was not a commentary on any itinerant peoples. Nothing was ever implied in this story that the couple intended her for any evil purposes, as evidenced by Mr. Mamatas’ suggestion that the problem could be fixed merely by giving her to the fairies or businessmen. Obviously, he still feels that the story didn’t go far enough to remedy the perceived racial and negative stereotyping.
5) The part I find most disturbing is that Mr. Mamatas is posting under a pseudonym with objections to things that, for the most part, no longer exist in the story. Protected by his anonymity, he is building an argument against my previous ignorance. It is everyone’s right to be offended by this story for whatever reason. Readers can also be horrified by my previous ignorance. What they perhaps should not be doing is judging a version of the story was not published here.
Someone did ask about my surname, and I am married to a Bulgarian, which doesn’t really have anything to do with anything because I was immersed in old fairy tales from the time I could read.
Comments
Good story, Lisa!
I very much understand the knee-jerk reaction to the plot device of selling a child to the peddlers, but I tried to be very careful about who behaved badly in the story, limiting it to my naughty little protagonist.
I hate the idea that I've offended anyone, but this morning has also been a lot of *facepalm* and *headdesk*
i threaten to sell my children on ebay all the time (to which my son cutely replies, "too late ebay!" with the biggest shit-eating grin you've ever seen)
the story is clearly fiction, a dark piece of fiction, but not to be taken as advocating trafficking in children (or starting wars and random beheadings, btw). i'm actually worried more about the kingdom run by a sadomasochistic 8-year-old and his dominatrix wife :P
on a side note, have you seen the role-playing game, "changeling: the lost," by white wolf? if you're into rpgs, i suggest checking it out.
The other day, she made a huge mess. All I did was lift my eyebrow and she grinned and said, "Baby for sale?"
That in and of itself would probably offend some people.
Two thoughts: Very entertaining story. People have too much time on their hands.
The next thing someone will be complaining about is the negative portrayal of pirates in fiction.
Philippa Gregory made a small fortune on the third novel in her Wideacre series: Meridon.
Here is the novel review by PW:
"With this elaborate tapestry of a young woman's life, the Lacey family trilogy ( Wideacre and The Favored Child ) comes to a satisfying conclusion. Meridon is the lost child whose legacy is the estate of Wideacre. She and her very different sister, Dandy, were abandoned as infants and raised in a gypsy encampment, learning horsetrading and other tricks of survival. They are indentured to a circus master whose traveling show is made successful by Meridon's equestrian flair and Dandy's seductive beauty on the trapeze. Meridon's escape from this world is fueled by pregnant Dandy's murder and her own obsessive dream of her ancestral home. After claiming Wideacre, Meridon succumbs for a while to the temptation of the "quality" social scene, but eventually she comes to her senses, and, in a tricky card game near the end of the saga, triumphs fully. The hard-won homecoming in this historical novel is richly developed and impassioned. Doubleday Book Club alternate."
This is Barb again. The gypsies here are pretty hard core and to the best of my knowledge, no one has taken Ms. Gregory to task. Lots of people enjoy stories about gypsies. We have some in the Noble Dead world, but J.C. named them the Móndyalítko . . . but they are clearly gypsies and popular characters.
And to those commenting in this LJ: just because the people complaining aren't using nice tones of voice doesn't mean they don't have a point.
As for the guy who was "itching for a fight:" it's so hard to listen to your ethnic group maligned over and over without becoming raw about it. I don't think he was itching for a fight. I think he was quite honestly hurt.
Again: don't mean to pick a fight with you in your journal. I feel that you tried to address this issue and just didn't go far enough. I think your heart is in the right place.
Again -- apologies for barging in here.
“It was the right sort of day to sell a child to the peddlers.”
Do you realize how offensive this is?
Being a telemarketer (the most hated group on the planet) that makes me a peddler, I guess. I was horribly offended at first, but I got over it. Must be your stellar prose that won me over. ;)
Some cultures even performed human sacrifice with their children as offerings. Other cultures force their daughters into marriages, pimp them out in the sex trade, mutilate their bodies and keep them uneducated generation after generation.
Taking offense at something and denouncing it does not erase it. It doesn't make the ugly stains on history disappear.
So, why the hell can't we discuss these things in fiction? I think it's important to do so. Crucial even.
Yes, we should be mindful of what we say and how we say it, but it seems like your story has struck a nerve.
That being said, I read the flamewar before I read your story. I must change what I have said above and say this: WTF?! Did they even read the same thing I did? Baby blood for matza? Romani? Gypsies? Racism? My head is reeling. I need a nap to recover from this tom-f*ckery.
If folks are offended, I'm glad. They deserve to have their bubbles popped and maybe realize not everything in this world is about them. And if they haven't threatened their children with selling them to carnies, gypsies, travellers, tinkers, elves, hobos, changelings, witches, the Baba Yaga, Dracula, or the Siberian labor camps, then they aren't doing their jobs as parents! :) Actually DOING any of these IS bad parenting.
Beautiful story. Once again, I am impressed. Sorry for the long-winded comment.
After reading the comments, though, I felt like I must be the most ignorant and uninformed of readers, because it never occurred to me that peddlers were always Roma or gypsies or any other ethnic group. When I was growing up, the peddler on our street (yes, we had a peddler who would come around in a beat up truck sharpening and selling knives and kitchen towels and stuff like that) was named Mr. McNamara. I always thought he was Irish. It's quite a lot to assume a word will conjure up only one's own associations.
Anyway, I thought the comments got off onto a self-propagating track, and had less to do with the story than other people's politics. The story is wicked good, and lays bare some of current Western society's assumptions about childhood, such as that children are precious and sweet (um, not all of them!), that they need adult protection to survive (to an extent, but they're pretty darn good at survival themselves!), and how parents who can't control a child just throw up their hands and let the child have its way, a la the little prince, who we know will grow up to be a despot with a horrid wife. But isn't that the real way of the world? Well done.
Sorry for the long comment. Just wanted to let you know about another reader who had no problem at all with your story!
Now that I've totally exhausted what could be an unfortunate metaphor, go have some chocolate.
You got me to finally sign-up for Livejournal. I read your story at Fantasy and then the comments that followed. Let me say that first of all I have enjoyed some of your previous fiction, specially The Girl With Blueberry Eyes.
I appreciated reading your explanation on the story and I don't think you intended anything evil, but it obviously offended some people and I do believe those comments should be taken seriously, which you have. So high-five for that.
What shocked me about the discussion was how many people threw the "it's just a fantasy story" excuse around, which to be seemed unfair to both you and the genre as a whole.
As I said over at Fantasy saying it’s just “fantasy fiction” or “speculative fiction” diminishes the importance of this type of fiction. It’s like saying it doesn’t matter because it’s not really literature, so it doesn’t deal with issues of any real importance.
I'll read the story soon and see what I think.
I think you handled the criticism very well.
Also, I've added you to my friends list, if you don't mind.
Edited at 2008-05-08 04:24 pm (UTC)
I am looking forward to reading your other stories.
Cheers,
C.
More to the point, I am not quite sure why I enjoy so much that of your fiction that I have read. It scratches a distinctly different literary urge than, for instance, the 'here is something neat, let us see what effect it has' style storytelling of Mieville or Banks, two of my current favorite authors. After much pondering, I think that at least part of it is the immersion in an internally consistent yet foreign logic system. Your prose does not exercise mathematically rigorous realism (duh), but nonetheless it has a certain sense of inevitability (as an evoked feeling, not as in trite or predictable). Neither does it disturb the illusion when influences that would be inconsequential in real life are revealed to be of transformative importance - for the duration of the narrative, this is perfectly reasonable.
Alternatively, it might just be that I enjoy clever and quirky.